Is Inner Speech Universal? Descriptive Experience Sampling & Myths of the Mind | Russell Hurlburt

What really goes on in our inner lives? Do we all think in words, narrating our experience with a constant "inner voice"? Or is that just a myth of the mind?

In this conversation, Dr Tevin Naidu speaks with Professor Russell Hurlburt, pioneer of the Descriptive Experience Sampling (DES) method, a groundbreaking approach to studying inner experience using random beepers and in-depth interviews. Hurlburt challenges our assumptions about consciousness, showing that what people think their minds are like often doesn’t match reality.

From inner speech to mental imagery, from unsymbolized thinking to the illusions we carry about our own minds, this episode dives deep into how psychology can actually study subjective experience. Along the way, we explore what this means for consciousness, selfhood, and the very methods we use to understand our minds.

About Russell Hurlburt:
Professor of Psychology at the University of Nevada, Las Vegas. Originator of the Descriptive Experience Sampling method, and author of six books on inner experience. He has studied everyday and clinical populations alike, from adolescents to patients with schizophrenia, anxiety, and bulimia.

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TIMESTAMPS:
00:00 Introduction: Who is Russell Hurlburt and why inner experience matters
03:02 Consciousness vs Mind: Why Russ avoids strict definitions and focuses on lived experience
05:34 Inventing the Beeper (1973): Origins of Descriptive Experience Sampling (DES)
07:41 From Questionnaires to DES: Why self-report methods failed and random sampling was needed
10:03 Intellectual Roots of DES: Phenomenology, eyewitness memory, and psychology’s blind spots
16:52 Skinner & Radical Behaviorism: Agreements, divergences, and the reality of private events
18:20 How DES Works: Random beeps, sampling, and expositional interviews explained
21:01 Inside the Method: What participants do during a DES study and how data is collected
23:32 Iterative Interviewing: Correcting armchair reports and improving experiential fidelity
30:18 Engineering Mind Meets Psychology: Why random sampling reveals hidden mental processes
33:48 Biggest Surprises from DES: Counterintuitive discoveries about everyday inner experience
36:16 Inner Speech is Rare: Why inner monologue is less common than most assume
42:01 Phenomenology of Inner Speech: Full sentences, missing words, voices, and spatial location
49:44 Clinical Relevance: How DES challenges psychiatric categories like DSM and ICD
54:44 Schizophrenia & Splattered Perception: Figure/ground breakdowns in inner experience
58:10 Inner Seeing vs. Mental Images: The difference between "seeing" and mere imagery
1:02:26 The Problem of the Self: Why defining the self is philosophically problematic
1:37:28 Future Directions in DES: AI, methodology, and a fidelity-based science of mind
1:53:45 Malleability of Inner Experience: Case studies (Fran, Mel) and closing reflections


EPISODE LINKS:
Russell's Website: https://hurlburt.faculty.unlv.edu//
Russell's DES interviews: https://hurlburt.faculty.unlv.edu/ieo...
Russell's Books: https://hurlburt.faculty.unlv.edu//sa...
Exploring Inner Experience: https://hurlburt.faculty.unlv.edu//sa...

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